"CCW Badges: Life Saver or Cheesy Gimmick..?"

[Bman505]

"CCW Badges" is one of the most heated topics that I've ever encountered in the concealed carry 'world'.

Just in case you're new to CCW Badges- A CCW badge is a badge that looks exactly like a police officer badge, but says something about "CCW Permit Holder" instead of "Law Enforcement Officer".

I'm not exactly sure what they say, because I've never actually seen one in person. I'm not going hide it- I am against the idea of people carrying "CCW Badges", but that's just my opinion. Now, listen to this:

Long story short, I've been getting a lot of emails and questions about these badges. Everything from people asking "are they a good idea" to people telling me what a good/bad idea they are.

And so, I got an expert to weigh in- Mr. Marty Hayes, President and Director of the Firearms Academy of Seattle, Inc., and one of the founders of the Armed Citizens' Legal Defense Network. He has over 30 years experience in law enforcement and firearms training, along with extensive experience as an expert witness and legal consultant.

Did I mention this guy is an expert? Well, here is what Mr. Marty Hayes has to say about CCW Badges. Read on, my friend!

Regarding CCW badges.
by Marty Hayes
Armed Citizens' Legal Defense Network

I strongly recommend against the practice of carrying a badge that identifies you as a concealed carry practitioner. There are several reasons for this recommendation. First off, you are much more likely to have contact with a police officer outside the context of a self-defense shooting, as you would be likely to have that contact after a self-defense shooting. When a police officer sees a private citizen carrying a badge, he immediately starts thinking "Strange Ranger" and will start treating you like one. This means taking whatever you say with a grain of salt, even if it is the obvious truth. If the police officer thinks you are attempting to impersonate a police officer, that is also a crime.

The next good reason to leave that CCW badge in the bottom of the junk drawer is that you might be mis-identified as a police officer by someone else in society, and be expected to act like one. The phrase "Officer, you have a gun DOOOOO something" comes to mind.

Third, if you are holding a silver object in your hand when the cops show up, do you think it might be mistaken for a silver gun? I have run thousands of people though tactical exercises where the targets were identified with badges, and many times, the person either ignored the badge and shot the target because it also had a gun, or mis-identified the badge as being a gun.

So, what is the solution for not being mistaken for a bad guy after a shooting?

Pretty simple, you already have the equipment. Your two empty hands, fingers outstretched with palms facing forward and your arms stretched above your head will absolve you of the crime of impersonating a bad guy when the cops show up. The idea that armed citizens get shot by police when the cops show up is more an urban myth than one founded in fact. If the armed citizen has his gun put away when the cops show up, with his hands above his head with palms exposed, he should be okay, even when confronted by the rankest of rookies.

Don't complicate your life any further, folks. Carrying a gun is complicated enough.

I got this article from Tim Schmidt USCCA - Owner / Founder.

I thought it would be good to talk about it here. I have one in the header on this site, what are your thoughts?:confused:

[rtuck77]

I got one but it stays in the truck I used it about twice but I usally forget that I have till after I think I need and by then I out of where I was going to wear it into.but now I am not sure if I will ever use it again.

[Descreet38]

Although I am no longer active as an Part-Time LEO I still have coffee and a few spirits with a lot of friends who are. About the only thing I know they all have in common is the hatred of a CCW badge.

Just not the way to go in MN, OK, TX, or MI to name a few.

[rtuck77]

I understand now that I've learned more about carring but when I frist got my premit I thought it was a good Idea but it was more of a waste of money

[AGust82]

If I'm a crazy guy bent on shooting a place up, I would take out any threats to myself first. I.E....cops, security, open carriers, badge wearers. Just makes you a target in my opinion.

[Jizzle]

:) can anyone find any documentation of a person OCing and being shot first because of it? if you can i'll buy you a box of ammo. BTW sorry for getting off topic.. My apologies.

[Bman505]

:) can anyone find any documentation of a person OCing and being shot first because of it? if you can i'll buy you a box of ammo. BTW sorry for getting off topic.. My apologies.

Hmmmmm, I am going to have to look now. I need ammo!!:)

[Jizzle]

this is a lifetime offer.

[Chuck]

Back on topic, if my choices are between lifesaver and cheesy gimmick, cheesy gimmick is the obvious winner.
Wearing any badge seems to be more of an attention getter than a problem solver.
Every now and then I see volunteer firefighters or EMTs wearing a badge on their belts (but no gun). It is very noticeable from a distance.
I prefer to keep a low profile.

[Bman505]

I agree. I knew this would be a good topic to discuss. I feel that the badge for CCW will disappear before too long!

[jniles]

What's the point of a CCW badge? The whole point to me is "concealment" and it's completely illogical to have a sign telling all, "Look at me I'm a target!" Or worse, "I'm a Loony!" Off topic but related to not logical is brandishing a gun. It's illegal in OK and probably all other places for a permit holder to do.

That is another example of the stupidity of our law makers. If you do it and it saves a life or two you are a felon anyway.

I understand the down side of making it legal but it's almost like the CCW badge. That badge is really a substitute for the gun and it is brandishing, IMHO.

If one shows his weapon when willing and needing to use it and it results in a back down or non-event in this state you are still guilty as a not-yet-convicted felon. How stupid! Showing a CCW should be a felony. Here if you present your weapon you must shoot the sucker to stay legal.

Sorry for mixing the subject up a bit.

Later,

John

[paul9mm]

Dont need no stinking badges

[paul9mm]

Here in mn we get this nice little laminanted card with the state seal and all we need on it goes right in the wallet

[Descreet38]

Hey Paul9mm - we need to get more Minnesotans on here. We are outnumbered by the guys/girls from NM. We need to turn that around to be MN.

[Bman505]

Good idea, but you have some serious work to do to make that happen. Believe me, I am fine with it though. The more the marrier.

[Leo]

I used to carry a badge, until coming upon the info on the DPS.NM.org website.

website: http://www.dps.nm.org/lawEnforcement/ccw/docs/10.8.2NMAC_17Nov05.pdf

G. Indicia of licensure. No person who is not a law enforcement officer, may carry a badge, patch, card, or any other indication of authority to carry a concealed handgun in New Mexico other than the license issued by the department or a license issued by a state that has been accepted by transfer, recognition or reciprocity by New Mexico pursuant to the act.

Needless to say, the badge is now in my junk drawer. I don't want to lose my CCW license for the novelty of a badge. Hope this info helped.

[Redz]

I used to carry a badge, until coming upon the info on the DPS.NM.org website.

website: http://www.dps.nm.org/lawEnforcement/ccw/docs/10.8.2NMAC_17Nov05.pdf

G. Indicia of licensure. No person who is not a law enforcement officer, may carry a badge, patch, card, or any other indication of authority to carry a concealed handgun in New Mexico other than the license issued by the department or a license issued by a state that has been accepted by transfer, recognition or reciprocity by New Mexico pursuant to the act.

Needless to say, the badge is now in my junk drawer. I don't want to lose my CCW license for the novelty of a badge. Hope this info helped.

Right, it is not legal for a NM CCW to display one of those cheesy badges.

I've seen them advertised for NM and can not figure out how they get away with that $%^&. I can see offering states where it's legal, but IMHO offering the badges specifically in a state where it is prohibited would open up an avenue for a serious lawsuit.

Obviously there is no substitution for knowing the laws of your state concerning CCW or OC, (did'nt forget you Jizzle :D) but often the laws are so convoluted that a person can easily make a mistake, without some scumbag helping them along while trying to make a buck. Especially someone who is completely new to firearms and does'nt really understand everything they are getting into, which covers a majority of new CCW's.

I'm no novice when it comes to guns been around them all my life, but when I got my CCW.... what an eye opener that was. I just thought I new what I was doing :o Still learning and expect to continue to do so.

Guess you know where I stand on this issue. :rolleyes:

[Jizzle]

and honestly, why would you want to wear a badge anyway? what purpose would it serve?

[jlsalc]

I know I'm a noob, and I have yet to receive my CCW, but I have plenty of life experience as well as somewhat of an LE background. I believe the biggest advantage a CCW carrier has is the element of surprise. How many times have one of us read a story of a 20ish year old being shot by grandma or grandpa. I'm sure it surprised the heck out of them when they were drawn on. I personally would rather be underestimated in any fight then the first targeted. If you want a badge, go to the police academy or similar.

*Off topic, I'll be looking for a legitimate article about OCers being targeted for my free box of ammo too.

Have a wonderful and safe day folks.

[BeenThereDoneThat]

I do not normally register for forums but I am so sick of hearing people whine about CCW Badges that I wanted to reply.

First, I do not care that this thread, topic or whatever you forum trolls care to call it is old. I know that, I am posting a reply anyways. :)

Second, I am retired with plenty of experience. I will not provide details so don't bother asking. It's none of your business.

Now to the topic of CCW badges. It is an individuals actions not badges that cause me to be concerned. Used for it's intended purpose the badge is perfectly harmless. You can just as easily impersonate a LEO with a gun.

LEO's hate these badges because they had to earn theirs and these can be purchased by anyone with access to the internet, period. LEO's hate it when any part of their "club" benefits are enjoyed by the general public. I have heard LEO's complain about loss prevention employees carrying handcuffs. Give me a break, their ego's are to blame for this complaint. When used properly and in the performance of their job the handcuffs are an important tool to those professionals and many others.

If the CCW badges are such a problem why doesn't our wise group of legislators ban them? You would think with all the "problems" that this would have happened ages ago...? or maybe those problems only exist on Forums like this? If you feel so strongly that these badges should be disallowed then do something about it. Until then they are 100% legal.

[Bman505]

Glad to have you with us BeenThereDoneThat! I agree with what you are saying. I just feel that if every individual that has a ccw and a badge, it can cause issues. Some people might think it is actually an LOE badge and if in the wrong hands, nothing but trouble.

[Garcia]

Just a reminder...in New Mexico concealed carry badges are forbidden.

[Luvs2Play]

Do you show the thug the badge before or after you shoot him? I think they are just something someone came up with to remove money from the pockets of American workers. Wish I would have thought of it first!

My permit that fits nicely in my wallet is all I need.

[deuce]

I don't know any other state but in Texas when I 1st got my chl we told the time to show this licence was to the police other than no one and I mean no one was to know if we were armed or unarmed other wise we would have open carry not cc. I am in way former military or law enforcement but have the utmost respect for both and look at this like this if they would have wanted us have badges they would have isused them and made law enforcement officers so i also prefer to keep it where know one know who is carrying and who is not.

[SigSauer]

Hmmmmm, I am going to have to look now. I need ammo!!:)

Please check out the link I have found, might answer your question.

Thanks, SigSauer

http://www.copblock.org/2187/mark-fiorino-nearly-shot-by-philly-pd-for-open-carrying/

[rtuck77]

just save your money and don't buy one

[Pir8fan]

If you're advertising the fact that you're a CCW permit holder, chances are you've just defeated the whole purpose of CONCEALED.

[Bman505]

Agree! Totally..

[BigDaddy™]

I have heard this topic ALOT people always ask whats the purpose? We still have no response, imho, waste of money and could be legal trouble waiting to happen.